Can a muslima marry a nonmuslim man of the scriptures?

by Hicham Mouna, Denmark, Tuesday, May 29, 2012, 06:56 (2549 days ago)

I stumbled upon this blog and found it an interesting read.

Although i cannot for myself say if he's right or wrong.

http://goatmilkblog.com/2010/08/24/muslim-women-should-be-able-to-marry-non-muslim-men-...

Would anyone be interested in sharing their knowledge on this topic?

--
Best regards
Hicham

- a novice in the long road of learning

Can a muslima marry a nonmuslim man of the scriptures?

by Quasim Hamdani, Chicago, Tuesday, May 29, 2012, 19:59 (2548 days ago) @ Hicham Mouna

One who submits to the supremacy of the laws of Allah and wants to remains a submitter, then he/she is advised to find / select a spouse who also submits.

Since we are to believe in all messengers as they were all one in purpose, then the people of the Book who submit to Allah are acceptable spouses.

We may call our selves Christians, Jews, Sunnis, Shias, Wahabis and others. In all these groups there are people who completely submit to Allah - perhaps not openly. These people are also acceptable spouses.

Iman is a state of mind which leads to the acts of submission. Most of the self-proclaimed Muslims do not possess Iman - just look at their actions and judge for yourselves.

Can a muslima marry a nonmuslim man of the scriptures?

by Rashid ⌂ @, Thursday, May 31, 2012, 11:44 (2546 days ago) @ Hicham Mouna

My take on this issue and as I understand:-
- God knows what people of the book believe in and yet calls them ‘people of the Book’. He knows what is in their heart. He is the only judge of that.
- Muslims too are ‘people of the Book’. Quran is a Book, with the same message in it that was given to all the previous Messengers, some named and some not named, and were sent to every nation on earth. So there must have been many messengers other than Bani Israils’.(Musnad gives a figure of 124000!?)
- Iman and decision to marry are BOTH self-conscious decisions to be made by baligh- ‘fully mature’- persons and independently.
- There is no compulsion in Deen and to convert including to the spouses “religion” otherwise it is a form of compulsion’, hence a no no.
- Family name of a father or mother has no bearing on mature persons’ Iman.
- As marriage is a contract of understanding and agreed commitments by both, the decision must, in its entirety remain the couple’s responsibility.
Therefore in ideal situation the decision rests with the couple to think it through as grown up mature people.

Can a muslima marry a nonmuslim man of the scriptures?

by Syed Ijlal Hussain ⌂ @, Karachi, Pakistan, Monday, June 11, 2012, 22:03 (2535 days ago) @ Rashid

5:5 This Day, all good food of your choice is made lawful for you. The
food of the People of the scripture is lawful for you. And your food is
lawful for them. You are permitted to marry chaste women of the People
of the scripture, (provided they do not indulge in Shirk … not associate
anyone with God 2:221). You are permitted to marry the virtuous, chaste
women among the believers and the virtuous, chaste women of those
who were given the scripture before.
You must give them their marriage
portions and live with them in honor, not in fornication, nor as secret
lovers. (It must be an honest wedlock 4:24.) Anyone who rejects belief,
his work is vain and he will be among the losers in the Hereafter.

The above ayat clearly nullifies the possibility of Muslim women marrying Christian/Jew men even if they are chaste. It also clarifies that those who have chosen to believe in The Quran cannot be called people of the book.

Another misconception I have seen on ourbeacon.com forum to allow already married women converted to Islam to stay with their non-believing husbands is nullified by Verse

60:10 O You who have chosen to be graced with belief! When believing
women come to you as immigrants, investigate their case, although only
God is best Aware of their faith. Once you establish that they are truly
believers, do not return them to the rejecters of the truth. They are not
lawful for the rejecters, nor are the rejecters lawful for them. Give the
rejecters what they have spent on them (as dowry). And there is no
blame on you if you marry these women, when you have given them
their due marital gift. And do not hold on to wedlock with women who
continue to deny the truth. And you may ask them for the dowry you had
paid, just as the rejecters have the right to ask the return of what they
spent. This is the Judgment of God. He judges between you, for God is
All Knower, All Wise.

God's Commandments are infinitely more important than what we may think of as humanitarian, for Allah is all wise, and we are not.

Can a muslima marry a nonmuslim man of the scriptures?

by Quasim Hamdani, Chicago, Thursday, June 14, 2012, 19:07 (2532 days ago) @ Syed Ijlal Hussain
edited by Quasim Hamdani, Thursday, June 14, 2012, 19:27

In referring to verse 5:5 you stated "The above ayat clearly nullifies the possibility of Muslim women marrying Christian/Jew men even if they are chaste. It also clarifies that those who have chosen to believe in The Quran cannot be called people of the book."

I think it is a matter of perspective when it comes to verse 5:5. This verse is stating that two types of women are permissible to a believer: a chaste believing woman and a chaste woman from the people given the scripture before. In both of these cases the woman in question has to agree to marry the suitor as a woman can not be married against her will (4:19). So what is the decision making process for the woman?

It does not say in the Quran that the believing women can only accept believing men as suitors.

On your other comment that believers in the Quran can not be called the people of the Book. Certainly Jews, Christians, Hindus and others can call us people of the Book.

Can a muslima marry a nonmuslim man of the scriptures?

by Syed Ijlal Hussain - Karachi ⌂ @, Karachi, Pakistan, Friday, June 15, 2012, 03:10 (2532 days ago) @ Quasim Hamdani

Dear Quasim Bhai,
Salamun Alaikum!

(your post has been quoted in red)

In referring to verse 5:5 you stated "The above ayat clearly nullifies the possibility of Muslim women marrying Christian/Jew men even if they are chaste. It also clarifies that those who have chosen to believe in The Quran cannot be called people of the book."

I think it is a matter of perspective when it comes to verse 5:5. This verse is stating that two types of women are permissible to a believer: a chaste believing woman and a chaste woman from the people given the scripture before. In both of these cases the woman in question has to agree to marry the suitor as a woman can not be married against her will (4:19). So what is the decision making process for the woman?

Dear Quasim Bhai, the above verse is clearly about the women, believing men can marry. Secondly, there is no argument against the requirement of a woman's will to marry the suitor. Surely a wedlock cannot occur unless the woman getting married, whether a believing woman or one from those who have been given the scripture before gives her consent willfully

It does not say in the Quran that the believing women can only accept believing men as suitors.

It actually does; First by limiting 5:5 to women that can be wedded to believing men, (and not to men from those who have been given the scripture before), and secondly through 60:10 "... Once you establish that they are truly
believers, do not return them to the rejecters of the truth. They are not
lawful for the rejecters, nor are the rejecters lawful for them...."

On your other comment that believers in the Quran can not be called the people of the Book. Certainly Jews, Christians, Hindus and others can call us people
of the Book.

I disagree on this. The Jews and Christians do not recognize and accept Muhammad (S) as God's messenger and Quran as a Holy Scripture. The Quran makes no mention whether Hindus were given the scripture or not so their inclusion is totally out of place here.

We accept the Jews and Christians as people of the book (or those who have been given the scripture earlier,) on the authority of The Quran. On what authority would you say they would accept us as people of the book?

Thanks!

Can a muslima marry a nonmuslim man of the scriptures?

by jawaid ahmed @, Birmingham, uk, Friday, June 15, 2012, 08:40 (2531 days ago) @ Syed Ijlal Hussain

The verse regarding believing women not marrying non-Muslim men is:-


Dr Shabbir 2:221 (Establishment of an ideal social system begins with the family. For a successful family life, uniformity of purpose is crucial. Therefore, (O believing men!) Do not wed Mushrikas till they acknowledge the Truth. A believing maid of God is better than a Mushrikah even though she may seem attractive to you. And do not establish marital bonds with Mushriks till they acknowledge the Truth. A believing servant of God is better than a Mushrik even though he may enchant you. They invite to the Fire, while God invites to Paradise and a well-preserved life by His Leave. He expounds His messages for mankind to ponder and take them to heart.
[Mushrik = Idol worshiper or idolater = One who ascribes partners to God = Who ascribes divinity besides Him = Who associates others with Him = Who invents or acknowledges authorities parallel to Him = Sets up idols in any form = Who side-lines Divine Revelation in favour of manmade books or themes = Who worships his desire = Hero worshiper = A sectarian = Whoever hopes for any dead humans or saints to help him = Ancestor worshiper = Who ascribes children to God = A believer in intercession by angels or humans = Who seeks Divine Guidance outside the Final Revelation = A subscriber or claimant to mysticism or clairvoyance = Who believes in created beings having Divine Powers = Accepts ultimate law-givers other than God = Prostrates before tyrants or “holy” men. Mushrikah = A Mushrik woman. Shirk 17:111, 25:2, 18:26, 40:12, 18:38, 18:42, 18:110, 24:55, 10:18, 30:31-32, 10:66, 6:14, 6:40-41, 9:31]


Regarding ourbeacon where women who find their husbands leaving Islam or women who convert to Islam when their husbands remain in their previous religion, the only reason presented for staying in the marriage is to maintain the family which is the best environment for everyone concerned. 60:10 is about women who have left their husbands, migrated, so the ruling states that you can dissolve their marriage [legally by those with this authority] and they are then free to re-marry someone else. In Mullahland the man can only initiate a divorce so this verse overrules their manmade sharia.

This next verse states that a new rule has been given so you should abide by it. However, if you have done something wrong in the past then do not repeat it but you do not have to change something that is already there.

4:22 Do not marry women whom your fathers ever married except what has already happened. Doing such was certainly a shameful and abominable custom.

If you are married to someone who was previously married to your father, then you can continue with this even though the rule now states you cannot do so. 60:10 has women leaving her husbands, so this leaving has to be undertaken first for any divorce to occur. She can stay with him if she decides to do so and there is the possibility of reasoning with him about his beliefs, giving him the opportunity to convert as well. If this fails and there is conflict in the home then the option remains to leave him. But they can continue to live as husband and wife if they want to.

Since most human beings fall into the definition of mushrik, the black and white distinction between Muslim and non Muslim becomes much greyer, so any blanket ruling regarding women definitely having to leave their husbands is not there, as well as who to marry in the first place [compromising our beliefs]!.

So we have a definite ruling that Muslim women are unable to marry non Muslim men which is different to the situation of converts to and from Islam within an existing marriage.

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